Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Pieterpaul » Fri Aug 29, 2008 10:55 am

I have an Elster M100 'Artist' water meter (see http://www.elster-meters.nl/downloads/MNRArtist.pdf dutch, or http://www.elstermetering.com/downloads ... e_0708.pdf english but less info).
According to the documentation the meter is or can be equipped with an magnetic contact so that a reed/pulse meter can be attached. It is unclear to me if my model has this magnetic contact or whether it can be fitted onto it (without tampering with the device of course). Does anyone know if my device has this magnetic part and if so, how I should attach the reed contact to be able to measure pulses?

Because of the black wheel with indentations (see picture in documents) I assume I could also fit an optical pulse meter, but if the device is already equipped with or prepared for some pulse mechanism I think it would make sense to make use of it. Does anyone have any experience with this type of meter?

Thanks and regards, PP
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Bwired » Fri Aug 29, 2008 11:53 am

Could be somewhere in the chassis, don't know?
It's a dutch company, just call them for the info.
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Pieterpaul » Fri Aug 29, 2008 12:43 pm

I did, according to them my type doesn't have the magnetic contact and I should contact the utility company to have it installed (as it requires the meter to be opened).

So I guess I'll have to go with the optical sensor. Would this work? The background of the black wheel is not reflective, but I assume it is at least better than the black wheel itself. Guess I'll just give it a try.

Thanks, PP
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Bwired » Fri Aug 29, 2008 12:58 pm

Yep, try but I doubt! otherwise you can always install an extra Alaxa watermeter.
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Pieterpaul » Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:18 pm

I don't know if I want to go that route. I am definitely not going to install it myself (don't want to run the risk of a water leak in my meter closet). But I'll try the optical sensor and see how far it gets me.

/PP
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Pieterpaul » Wed Sep 03, 2008 6:20 pm

I tried the optical sensor today and as expected it indeed doesn't work. In general, the sensor seems to be able to detect the difference between black and white surfaces, but on the water meter it detects nothing (not even when I move it around by hand).
I'm thinking that this is most likely due to the fact that the distance from the glass to the surface is too large for the sensor to detect the reflecting signals (or at least the difference thereof). There is at least about a centimeter in between the glass window and the actual meter surface (and dial).
So this means that my options are down to having my current meter equipped with the pulse detector by the water utility company (in case they would even be willing to do so, it is probably going to be expensive) or installing an additional meter that does allow detection (like some other forum members have done). At this point, neither option looks very attractive to me, so without further hints, tips or tricks that means I won't be collecting water usage statistics any time soon [:(]
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby b_weijenberg » Wed Sep 03, 2008 6:59 pm

try with P2 on the RFXPulse turned fully ClockWise
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Sooty » Thu Sep 04, 2008 8:46 am

It really is not that difficult to fit a second water meter as long as you have room to fit it in.

Here in the UK there is now a multitude of different "Quick Fit" water pipe fittings which make this type of work very easy for the novice.

I have recently fitted 2 meters with pulse output from here http://www.smartpowershop.co.uk/ for hot and cold water.

I took this approach of fitting my own meter, because the utility water meter is installed in the road which is 50 meters from my property.

I also have an Elster BK-G4 gas meter, so I just purchased the add-on pulse module which clips onto the meter.

I am waiting for delivery of another pulse module from RFXCom and then I just need to make some changes to my monitoring scripts to deduct the hot water usage from the cold and add another chart for the hot water.

Paul..
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Pieterpaul » Sat Sep 20, 2008 10:45 am

I finally got around to playing some more with the RFXPulse module and my water meter. I took Bert's advice and increased the LED voltage almost to the max and I have been able to get a reading from the water meter. By moving the sensor over the glass shield I could see pulses whenever I moved over the black wheel. With a little bit (hmmz, actually a lot) of trying and moving to get it into the right position, I could finally actually detect the wheel going round.
I have had to make a cover (of paper) around the water meter, because the sunlight seems to be interfering with proper detection. I have tried to improve reliability by changing the LED power and the trigger level, but I am not sure if it helped. Anyway, for low water usage the detection seems to be pretty much okay (although for the 'ON' position the LED on the rfxpulse is not fully lit, not sure if that is an issue), but for high water usage (and thus a quick spinning wheel), the reliability seems to be not so well: in any case it looks like it is missing pulses from the LED output. I will see how bad it deviates from the water meter reading. Any ideas how I could improve reliability?

Thanks, PP
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby b_weijenberg » Sat Sep 20, 2008 1:14 pm

I have the feeling that this configuration is not the best solution because of the fact that it is very critical how to position the sensor. To improve the readings for the quick spinning wheel you try to set the debounce straps on the RFXPulse module to zero. See the RFXPulse doc.
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Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Pieterpaul » Sat Sep 20, 2008 2:53 pm

I have the same feeling [:(]

After a couple of hours it stopped giving pulses completely. Not sure if it is caused by rising temperature or by slight movement of the sensor, but apparently the setup is just too fragile.
Maybe I need to install an additional water meter after all. But I'm afraid that has a too high WAF (for now).

/PP
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Re: Measuring water usage with Elster M100 MNR-S

Postby Mfr » Sun Apr 19, 2015 9:38 pm

Hi,

I saw this solution: http://zil.olammi.iki.fi/sw/dialEye/. This should work for the Elster M100 water meter or probably any analog watermeter. Cons are you need to buy a cheap IP camera and need to run Python. Pros are that it will save you some plumbers work on the water piping.

Mark
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