Looking for wired devices.

[krijgsman]

As a new member to this forum I have tried to read the rules and hope that this post is OK. I have already spent much time reading other posts and this post is a result of all the questions that remain unanswered.

I have some experience with home automation but only on a “consumer” level. Currently we are renovating our home (in NL) and I have the excellent opportunity to make a new start; buy decent hardware and configure everything properly.

On the web are a lot of websites dedicated to people who have shared their experiences on how they have implemented home automation at home. The more I have read, the more I get lost. Time is running out, in a few weeks time the ceilings and walls will be closed.
Not everything needs to be done right now. However, there are things that I can do now that will save me from a lot of hassle later.

I’d like to use –wired- hardware as much as possible but I have the trouble finding the proper hardware. I will use wireless alternatives instead but as I can put the wires in place right now I’d love to hear if there are any wired devices that I can use or a good reason why wireless is just as good

1. Motion detection, preferably in ceiling and/or AC powered (for both lights on/of, and security)
2. Window/door detection
3. Smoke detectors (AC powered)

Please note that I haven’t decided on any particular domotica system yet. The availability of wired devices will influence this decision. Buying a complete security system that can communicate with the domotica is also an option but I haven't found any system that is fast enough to communicate (motion detection -> security ->

Any help in this will be highly appreciated.

Kind regards.
Dirk Krijgsman

[Alexander]

I think the best option for you is to visit some members at their homes. They are happy to show you around.

[olof]

Dirk,

Hi,
Just my 2-cents worth. About a year ago, I was facing similar choices in wired vs wireless choices when we were remodelling the house. Choices for alarm system, audio/visual, lighting, home automation, etc.. After reading/researching for hours, I went with a combo of wired / wireless.

Wired
Wireless technologies (Wifi, z-wave, zigbee, plugwise) are now able to take over many functions of what previously only wired could do. Even so, I decided to invest in laying down cables, because in 2011 some applications still require wiring for quality results:

A. Cat6 cables to as many points as I could think of:
2x behind each (potential) TV location
4x behind home office desk (fixed PC spot, network printer, ....)
Various places around the kitchen (future appliances, future PC,....)
2x to each bedroom
1x to each (potential) IP camera location (inside and outside the house) for Power-Over-Ethernet (POE).
Cellar
Attic
Outside shed ('schuur' in Dutch) / Garage

The installer called my crazy I wanted CAT6 instead of CAT5. He's right in 2011, but I want to be futureproof for the next 10-20 years. Besides the cost difference was, for me, too little.

B. Good quality speaker wire to:
5 spots in the living room (5.1 surround system)
2 spots in the Kitchen
2 spots in 2 Bedrooms
Cellar

C. Good old coax cable to each TV spot.

D. HDMI cable from central location to main TV spot (living room in our case)

E. Node zero
All the above cables end at one central location ('node zero'). In my case it was a cabinet in the hallway. In Holland called 'Meterkast'. I wanted as many 'boxes' as possible to reside in this cabinet instead of cluttering around the TV in the living room or other places in the house. Things such as Cable Box (Ziggo, UPC,..), Stereo Amplifier, WIFI router, Ethernet Switch, etc...

F. Extra Electrical outlets
-Node zero / cabinet in hallway needed about 8 extra outlets
-Also the location where I have my NAS and Home Automation servers
-main TV location. For stuff that can't go into 'Meterkast' such as game consoles (PS3, Wii,) and perhaps Blue Ray player
Location I underestimated:
-Extra outlets where you plan to sit down with you laptop. For us, this was near the kitchen table. My wife and I now 'fight' over the sole outlet there....
-Figure out the location(s) where you will charge your phones, tablets, etc.. and put outlets there

G. Lighting
Most of the lighting locations + lightswitches in our house were in the right location. Those spots that I want to control with home automation I replaced the switches with switchplates with build-in Z-wave capability. Some extra lightswitch locations were added by the electrician.
Some other extra switch locations he did not add because the cost was too high. There I went wireless with battery-operated Z-wave solutions from Merten.
These battery operated Z-wave things have operated 100% reliable with no lag. The standard Z-wave lightswitches as well btw.

Wireless:

H. Alarm system (Visonic)
The house we bought had a 10-year old wired/wireless alarm system in place. Various sensors and wires got damaged during first phase of remodeling. When I spoke to various alarm installers, they told me that most of their new alarm installations for houses is wireless.
I went with Visonic (self-installed) because of
(a) good reviews and
(b) the possibility to read the sensor output (using RFXCom) and using it in home automation (Homeseer in my case).
(c) the level of expertise available in this forum on integrating Visonic with one's home automation system

It's possible to use a home automation system (Homeseer, ....) also as an alarmsystem, but i.m.h.o. it will always be less reliable. Home automation software runs on a PC with all the inherent instabilities. I don't want my alarm to be out of order because of a PC malfunctioning.

I. Non-Alarm sensors (smoke, CO2, water leakage detection)
I took the Visonic sensors and not independent Z-wave one's. Same reason as above, reliability of performance. They must be active 100% of the time, without worrying about rebooting PC's, software bugs, etc... Sensor output through RFXCom can be read into home automation and e-mailed/sms to me.

Other non-alarm sensors (temperature, humidity) I haven't installed yet, but since they are not as critical as above, I will use Z-wave.

J. Lighting control = Z-wave
I don't have any legacy technology (such as X10), and based on reading around, I decided to go with Z-wave for my lighting control. My brand choice is Merten

K. Music = Sonos
A separate wireless network, with stellar performance. We now play much more music than before, simply because it's so easy. Love the Ipad and Android apps

L. Media Server = XBMC
Not yet installed, but some day (I hope)
Will run next to my NAS server and via CAT6 cables hooked up to the TV

M. Remote control for TV, 5.1 Surround,
Harmony 900
That way, I can control all 'the boxes' from my couch when all that hardware stuff is sitting in the cabinet in the hallway

Some interesting links

http://www.cnet.com/1990-10839_1-6224211-1.html

Nice spreadsheet (4 tabs) comparing various technologies. It's from 2008, but still interesting
docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ag ... l=en#gid=0

Hope this helps!

Cheers,
Olof

[krijgsman]

Olof, Thank you so much for your reply. It will be very helpful. Many of the things you mention is already planned. It seems that we want exactly the same things. The problems that you mentioned with the outlets is something I also forgot about, partly then; in the bedroom I already planned for outlets for charges but I forgot about the livingroom! I also will use CAT6 and planned about the same amount. The "Meterkast" will be resized (1.00m by .70m deep from floor to ceiling) and will act as a central point for everything with two large direct connections to my study-room in the attic. For sound we are already using Logitech Squeezebox and we use AppleTv2 with XMBC on all TV's, connected to our Synology (just like the Squeezeboxes btw) We too use a Harmony Remote to control it all but I am going to test a Harmony Link soon

As a result from you post, I will consider Z-wave. I never considered it before as I thought it was expensive hardware that was not easy to control with software like Homeseer (still considering a Mac-version software for this) but it sounds like I should focus on Z-wave. As for the security: if Visonic can run both stand-alone AND be picked up by my RFXCom that would be ideal!

Thanks again for your post.

@Alexander: Right now I have only my own experience, websites and YouTube movies to base my opinion on. Non of my friends use Domotica (yet). I'd love to see how everything will work in real live. How would I go about to ask people for an invite? Is there a special part on this forum for? Or even a special website?

[olof]

Dirk

Olof, Thank you so much for your reply.

You're welcome, happy to hear that my stuff is actually informative

As a result from you post, I will consider Z-wave. I never considered it before as I thought it was expensive hardware that was not easy to control with software like Homeseer (still considering a Mac-version software for this) but it sounds like I should focus on Z-wave.

Z-wave and Homeseer is a no-brainer for virtually all Z-wave Europe-based producers/products. Except for Merten lighting materials ('schakelmateriaal'), which I picked purely because I think it looks the nicest (domoticaforum.eu/viewtopic.php?f=50& ... ten#p51269. Alas, it is also the most expensive.
Also, Merten requires a minor intermediary step before Homeseer can fully deal with it. No big deal really but still a minor hassle
There's lots of Merten info on the forum. See, for example, http://domoticaforum.eu/viewtopic.php?f ... ten#p44659

On this forum, it appears that Düwi and ACT z-wave products are favored. Partly of their reliability, and easy-integration with Homeseer and other controllers. But also because they look very similar to existing light-switches in most houses. Non-z-wave stuff can then easy be bought in local stores to get a harmonised look in the house

Alternatively, use your existing light switches, etc.. and insert Fibaro z-wave units behind them. See for example: http://domoticaforum.eu/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=6680

As for the security: if Visonic can run both stand-alone AND be picked up by my RFXCom that would be ideal!

It is exactly the reason I bought Visonic.

I'd love to see how everything will work in real live. How would I go about to ask people for an invite? Is there a special part on this forum for? Or even a special website?

An interesting source of further info & assistance for you could be forum member Tane. He is actually been on TV a few years ago because of all the home automation stuff in his house. He also runs a webshop, and I've bought most of my home automation stuff from him. He's helped me out from time to time when I get stuck.

Cheers,
Olof