Xanura vs. Marmitek

Post by **Snelvuur** » Sat Nov 17, 2007 1:18 pm

mindbender: http://wiki.binkey.nl i've allready put some information on it, but a helping hand is always nice.

// Erik (binkey.nl)

Post by **Gourmet** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:04 pm

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by MindBender
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Digit
 Yes, i reaaly think it is an art being able to read all topics on a forum while being a member for only 2 days.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
That's definitely true. We are finally in the luxurious position where this forum has gathered plenty of useful information. We can't expect new members to read everything before starting to ask questions

Yet it's very hard to find the answer on a specific question. Perhaps it's time to organize all this information is a more cataloged manner, like a Wiki. Pieter?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I don't know if READING information is an art but I'm sure that FINDING (or CHASING) it is sometimes a full time job.
Above all when it's not obvious to find discriminant words.
Well, I've now a answer: finding DAIX10.
Surely another full time job.

Thank you,
db

db

Post by **Gourmet** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:13 pm

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
Surely another full time job.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I finally found a DAIX10 but that's not the convenient box because it can only switch 250W. I need to switch 1500W.
I think that only the dimmers (that obviouly need a triac) are really silent. But, dimmers are, of course, limited in the power they can manage.
So I think that the only mean to switch a high load SILENTLY from the point of view of the room this load is in is to use a head switch in the distribution panel. But, for this we need to have one wire by high load which is not my case

Another ideas ?
db

db

Post by **MindBender** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:23 pm

In that case a DAIX10 isn't a solution becuase they always fade in and out while switching the load on and off. I suppose your 1500Watts aren't lamps and appliances hardly ever like being faded.

If you want to stay withing the Xanura range there are few other options than combining a solid state relay with either a SAX15, SAX35 or DAIX10.

But I'm sure other manufacturers offer integrated solutions.

Post by **Gourmet** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:26 pm

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by MindBender
 Breaking News: There is most definitely a difference between the Xanura SAIX module and the Marmitek AWM2.

They use the same injection molds for the housing, but another color of plastic.

They even use the same PCB, but the SAIX module has an extra triac installed (ST Micro, BTA16, TO220 housing).

Both use a Microchip PIC processor for the intelligence, but the labels stuck to them have different numbers written on them: 70AC for the AWM2 and 70AB for the SAIX. Now usually these numbers are checksums, but that would either mean that there's only one bit different in both versions, or that it's a big coincidence (1:65536). There's probably a flag somewhere in the software specifying which unit it is, while all functionality is present.
I didn't check if I can read out its contents; PIC processors have internal security measures to prevent that, so I didn't even try. There are test pads on the back of the PCB and I'm sure the in-circuit-programming pins of the PIC are connected to some of them. These are probably used to program it.

The AWM2 unit uses a PIC16CE625, which is a 'one time programmable' chip. I didn't remove the label of the SAIX unit, but I assume the same processor is used.

Photo of SAIX internals: [img]images/icon_paperclip.gif[/img] SAIX.JPG 26.83?KB

Photo of AWM2 internals: [img]images/icon_paperclip.gif[/img] AWM2.JPG 26.9?KB
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">After wishing a new year to everybody on this forum site, I'd like to come back on this interesting post.
The picture don't let us see the characteristics of the relay each product is equipped with.
Does someone know how many switches the relays are able to ensure in each case (Marmitek and Eiton)?
In my case 100,000 would not be enough.

db

db

Post by **MindBender** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:36 am

Check the detailed photo here:
ftp://delien.eu/public/DSCN1070.JPG
I doubt it will do over 100,000 switches but you can always get a dimmer instead which is solid state.

Post by **Gourmet** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:46 am

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by MindBender
 Check the detailed photo here:
ftp://delien.eu/public/DSCN1070.JPG
I doubt it will do over 100,000 switches but you can always get a dimmer instead which is solid state.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Thank you Mind, I'll check this tonight since I've no FTP access at this moment.
The problem with dimmers (equipped with a triac) is that they're not enough powerful.

Why I need so many switches is about heating regulation for radiants.
Such appliances keep the heat a few minutes when they are put in a off state after a run period. So, managing this kind of device results in doing PWM with their power line.
This implies a consequent number of switches during the winter (approx. once a minute during half the day: 700 times per day).

Another way would be to use the pilot wire. Helas, it's not obvious to switch off completely an appliance though this way: only comfort and eco modes are easily available.

Edit: in fact the pilot wire seems to be the best solution for me. It allows me to use a triac-based switch which has both advantages to be silent and to be able to switch millions of times. And stop mode however is available through a diod.

db