FS20 SU Micro Module

[ajwkappe]

Is someone familiar with the FS20 SU micro module? Currently I use a KAKU micro module behind an existing switch for both manual and auto control of the lights, however I would like to be able to not just 'toggle' between the selections but be able to send On and Off signals, no matter of the state the module is in. Currently when the lights are on and I send a signal to the switch when I start an activity it will turn the lights off, however when I would be able to send a On signal, it would just leave the lights on, is anyone familiar with this device and knows if it will act that way?

Thanks!
Alex

[b_weijenberg]

I don't know which KAKU module you are using but the current KAKU appliance modules will switch On if an On command is send no matter how often and will switch Off when an Off command is send.

The lamp modules will go in a DIM cycle if 2 ON commands are send. However with the new KAKU lamp modules (starting with order code A) have dim set levels and you can send a set dim level 15. It does not matter if you send multiple set dim level 15 commands.

[ajwkappe]

I have the AWMR-230 installed. It is combined with a regular switch and no matter what command you send, On or Off, it will always toggle... so if the ligts are Off, and you send a Off command, it will switch the lights On.

[b_weijenberg]

I can be wrong because I do not own an AWMR230 but when you send an ON command using a KAKU remote, KAKU RFwall switch or RFXCOM transmitter the module will switch ON. Transmit a RF OFF command and the module will switch OFF.

It is true that the mechanical wall switch connected to the AWMR230 toggles the module state.

[ajwkappe]

Correct, and because it toggles using the wall switch it is not capable of using the discreet On or Off signals the way other modules work. Therefore I was looking for a different module from FS20 and it looks like the SU module has the capability of accepting strict On/Off signals without toggling, it does need a 'pulse' switch though but I believe they are available from the Berker S1 Switch line that I have installed in my home.

Thanks for 'thinking' with me!

Regards
Alex

[b_weijenberg]

Remove the mechanical switch and stick the WST8800 or AWST8802 on it?
I don't know the FS20's so can't tell you about this.

[ajwkappe]

That would have been the easiest yes, however the WAF factor has to be considered so it needs to be in lign with the appearence of the other switches in the house. I will give it a try with the fs 20 and a pulse switch from Berker, I'll post my findings in this threat.

Tx

[ajwkappe]

I have to come back to this post. Apparently you were 'right' and I was 'wrong'

WHen testing I was using the new configured Harmony with the JB Light Manager. Yesterday, however my wife used the standard remote control that we had in place before the JB. Then I was talking about this issue with her and she said, don't know what you are talking about but it always listens to On and Off commands in the way you would expect it, so if its off and you send an off signal, it stays off...

AFter research I discoverred that I had assigned the 'toggle' action to the on and off buttons on my Harmony ... don't laugh... so the WAF factor increased with a good 200% on this one as she was smarter than I was

Thanks and topic closed !

[richard naninck]

Got lot's of these modules both in switch or dim casing. They just do what you address them to do. If the module is on and you send on, it stays on. Visa versa for off etc.
Dimmer can turn on, off, bright or dim. If the dimmer is off and a dim command is issued, the module turns on full bright and dims from there. If the module is off and a bright command is issued, the module turns on full dim and brights up from there. When an on command is received the module falls back to the last dim state it was in.
I got some in the wall and others directly in a lamp. Works fine either way.
Seen by the date of the first post, you may have a solution already..

[jrkalf]

Got lot's of these modules both in switch or dim casing. They just do what you address them to do. If the module is on and you send on, it stays on. Visa versa for off etc.
Dimmer can turn on, off, bright or dim. If the dimmer is off and a dim command is issued, the module turns on full bright and dims from there. If the module is off and a bright command is issued, the module turns on full dim and brights up from there. When an on command is received the module falls back to the last dim state it was in.
I got some in the wall and others directly in a lamp. Works fine either way.
Seen by the date of the first post, you may have a solution already..

Richard,

I'm a bit hesitant to buy these modules as I don't understand the connection possibilities of the devices. They seem like very slim and easy to built in behind walls, but I don't understand how to implement them on in-place solutions like already present dimmers and on/off lights. Hence I've used the big FS20 SW1 modules in the walls right now. They take up half of a "muurpotje" as they're 20,4 mm thick.

Could you describe a bit on the use-cases and implementations of these devices?


Jelle

[richard naninck]

When I bought my house, I completely redid all electrical wiring and removed all black wires. So now I only got brown and blue (and in most case yellow ground) going to my 220V wall outlets and lights. The in wall positions where all the switches were are now empty.. as in no wires at all. I put FS20 S4UB's in my walls triggered by all new pulse switches from Jung.
The SU modules mostly reside at the lamp itself. The SU module is connected to the brown and blue wires as input and the 2 wire output goes to the lamp. The S4UB sends a command, the SU receives it and carries it out like turning a light on or off.

Same can be done with the SU unit in wall but now you have to maintain the black wire in your system. (I guess this will be your case then):

You need to let go of conventional dimmers and probably also the standard switches. Pulse switching is going to be what you need. An SU can be controlled directly a pulse switch using the two small (program) wires but you are going to need very deep in wall boxes to be able to do that. I didn't have the space so I went for the S4UB. Also when you want your PC to be in the loop and display the current status of your lights, you need an S4UB because it will send a message whereas a directly controlled SU would not. And now for the wiring: In wall you have brown, blue and black. Brown and blue going into the switch and black and blue coming out to the lamp. Take out the switch and install the SU in the same way. Brown and blue powering the SU and black and blue controlling the power from the SU to the lamp.

If you do it like that, you probably can't make a so called hotel switch. If you do it my way and use the S4UB, you can make up for as many hotel switches to control one (or more) lights as you want. The SU is at the lamp and the S4UB's anywhere in the house can control the same light because they send a signal to the SU and the PC and even more SU's if you want more lights in different positions to switch at the same time. It is a very flexible system exactly meant for older houses you can't rewire. Take out all the black wiring and you're done
Come to think of it, if you install the SU in wall and you want to create a hotel switch you need to simply install an extra S4UB which controls the SU. Hope this is all a bit clear?!

If you ever want your PC to be able to display the current status of your lights, use S4UB's because the FHZ1300 will also catch the signals. Maybe now the repeater comes into perspective. Lights controlled by an S4UB will show up on the FHZ1300PC and with use of a repeater so do the PC based switch actions because the FHZ receives its own signals again.

I removed the black wire to make room in my small in wall boxes, but you can let it sit there if you ever want to restore the NEN standard. I choose not to.

Have been using the S4UB's for over two years now without any problems. Batteries should last upto 10 years according to the manual.

Since the FHZ1300PC receives the S4UB's, I can also do lots of other stuff with standard (WAF) pulse switches from Jung. For example I have switches turning on and off my receiver for music and volume control is done using the dim and bright messages. Same goes for the fire place and even curtain control. The PC gets the signal, handles it and from there I can do anything else my setup is capable of. Open a garage door, turn on ventilators etc etc.

Post has become a bit long.. sorry for that

[jrkalf]

Not lenghty at all and quite clear. Seems that the S4u and S4uB are quite usefull for me. I'm not using any pulse switches or older switches at all. At the moment for the hallway and upstairs I'm using a combination of a FS20 TouchControl 6 and 2x a FS20 S4A-2. I think the S4A switches are easiest to use. The TC6 is a bit harder to implement mostly because of it's VERY BULKY 3x AA penlite batterypack.

So I chose to leave the black wiring in place and to code all the patched wires where it's applicable. But in the main locations no re-wiring was required.
I'll probably acquire one in the next purchase batch to check it out.

BTW, I'm removing myself from the FHZ1000pc very soon. In my use-case with FHEM, I'm moving towards either a CUL or CUNO device. The device costs less with more connectivity options and the option to attach a real antenna for better sending and reception capabilities.

[richard naninck]

I tested a Touchcontrol 6 once and left it alone because of ergonomics. No backlighting makes it impossible for the WAF to find the correct switch in the dark. Wouldn't be a big problem because my setup switches lights on and off automatically using the alarm sensors but still... There was another big issue why I didn't want it, but I can't recall it now.

I got 6 S4A's but only in places where no wall boxes are available like outside in the veranda and in the cellar. They work fine, but just don't have the looks of the standard (in my case Jung) switches. These S4A's are mainly there to control other stuff like outside music etc.

I never heard about the CUL before and read up on it but it seems it needs firmware and I can't confirm that it would be 100% compatible with the FHZ1300PC firmware thus introducing a big variable in my system. If it does have good and confirmed firmware, I might also try it because of the antenna. The FHZ1300PC has a quarter wave antenna just like a CUL with a flexi antenna would have but still I think the antenna part in the FHZ could be better and it would be very nice to have a strong(er) signal in both reception and transmission. I never actually tried to change polarity by repositioning the FHZ. I do know that my repeater needs to face up for it to work best. If facing down, it doesn't perform that well so antenna polarity is a big player..

[jrkalf]

Richard, we're taking this discussion into the fhz/cul thread. To avoid a wild growth of various topics in one thread.