We are redoing our new home and currently are busy with the bathroom. We like to keep track of our water-usage and are planning to buy two Alexa watermeters (one for cold, one for hot water).
In the bathroom we want mirror-heating. In our old house the mirror-heating was wired simultaneously with the lights. That works fine, but it also means it was switched on when it was not needed. E.g. when taking a bath instead of a shower or when doing other stuff (cleaning, using the wc etc) which don't generate lots of steam.
So this time we'd like to have a smarter way to turn the heating on without using a separate switch for the mirror. We tried that before and it usually meant you forgot to turn it on and had to wait a few minutes before you could use the mirror or -worse- you just forgot to turn it off.
So we think we can manage this with a separate Xanura module to turn the mirror on/off and have a "smart" way to see if someone is taking a shower. We could use a few "shower-timeslots" (usually we take showers around the same time of day) and just turn the mirror on/off during that time when the lights in the bathroom are on and the hot watermeter is showing usage.
But perhaps we can be even smarter and install another way to detect if the shower is running. We could use another watermeter (on the waterpipe to the shower) but this seems a bit overkill. I don't really need to know the water-usage, just if the shower is on or off.
We could use just a "flowmeter" which will give a signal if water is running, but they seem more or less as expensive as a full-blown watermeter.
We thought about having a temperature-sensor on the waterpipe, but I'm afraid the waterpipe will cool down too slow to reliable detect the end of the shower.
Does anybody have some experience with this or perhaps even a better idea?
Watermeter / flowmeter
Watermeter / flowmeter
I've had a 1-Wire temperature sensor attached to the boiler output water pipe. Of course cooling down is much slower then warming up. I could do some tests to give you an idea if this can work.
Watermeter / flowmeter
If you can do that it would be great! 
Watermeter / flowmeter
Je kunt de spiegel ook schakelen in combinatie met een Oregon humidity sensor. Met een bepaalde hoeveelheid stoom zal je spiegel dan aan gaan.
Admin:PLEASE ENGLISH
Admin:PLEASE ENGLISH
Watermeter / flowmeter
Perhaps the best options is a Oregon THGR228N combined with Oregon THC138 temperature humidity sensor.
One has a small remote sensor which you can put on the pipe and the other one can be used for environment in the bathroom.
I have place my sensor way up on a closet, once I put the warm water on the humidity is going up fast. It's going down very fast once the hot water is put off because of the ventilation which is still on for x minutes.
other option: I think you have a (house)ventilator in the bathroom as well, make a switch for this in the bathroom as well. Once you switch this on (automatic or not) you can switch the mirror heating on as well.
You should make a solid construction because otherwise the heating is on for nothing a lot of times.
All sort of combinations are possible.
One has a small remote sensor which you can put on the pipe and the other one can be used for environment in the bathroom.
I have place my sensor way up on a closet, once I put the warm water on the humidity is going up fast. It's going down very fast once the hot water is put off because of the ventilation which is still on for x minutes.
other option: I think you have a (house)ventilator in the bathroom as well, make a switch for this in the bathroom as well. Once you switch this on (automatic or not) you can switch the mirror heating on as well.
You should make a solid construction because otherwise the heating is on for nothing a lot of times.
All sort of combinations are possible.
Watermeter / flowmeter
Hi Jeroen,
Some things you might consider, depending on your bathroom layout/shower compartment:
- Humidity sensor in the shower (which may also be an indication for fogging of your mirror)
- Temperature sensor in the shower
- Humidity sensor in the shower/bathroom fan exhaust
- Temperature sensor in the shower/bathroom fan exhaust
- Water sensor in the shower (maybe a few mm above the floor, so that it only senses water if the shower is really on)
- Tempeature sensor on hot water pipe or waste water pipe, as suggested above
And maybe even a combination of some of these. Slow changes of these values after taking a shower seem to be the main problem. Maybe you could combine this with the status of the bathroom/shower lights (if lights are off, switch off the mirror heating anyway, even if environmental values are "high")? Add a number of shower timeslots and maybe a condition on the general hot and cold water usage and you should be fine in most cases.
If you want certainty, you should go for a separate water usage meter.
Lennart
Some things you might consider, depending on your bathroom layout/shower compartment:
- Humidity sensor in the shower (which may also be an indication for fogging of your mirror)
- Temperature sensor in the shower
- Humidity sensor in the shower/bathroom fan exhaust
- Temperature sensor in the shower/bathroom fan exhaust
- Water sensor in the shower (maybe a few mm above the floor, so that it only senses water if the shower is really on)
- Tempeature sensor on hot water pipe or waste water pipe, as suggested above
And maybe even a combination of some of these. Slow changes of these values after taking a shower seem to be the main problem. Maybe you could combine this with the status of the bathroom/shower lights (if lights are off, switch off the mirror heating anyway, even if environmental values are "high")? Add a number of shower timeslots and maybe a condition on the general hot and cold water usage and you should be fine in most cases.
If you want certainty, you should go for a separate water usage meter.
Lennart
Watermeter / flowmeter
Sensor re-attached to pipe and HA7Net, data is being stored to the database.
Later in the evening we'll see what the results are...
Later in the evening we'll see what the results are...
Watermeter / flowmeter
http://www.hekkers.net/domotica/TemperatureCharts.aspx , the last one.
I'll provide info about where and for how long hot water was used later.
I'll provide info about where and for how long hot water was used later.
Watermeter / flowmeter
The idea for the ventilation was to turn this higher once the light is on and off after x minutes delay when the lights are off). This is because we only have 1 ventilation unit for multiple rooms. The "stand alone" toilet (which doesn't get humid at all) is on the same ventilation unit and I'm not sure there are "smell-detectors" 
The mirror should be turned off when the lights go off, that's true (it makes no sense shaving in the dark). I've also thought about putting in a motion detector, to "see" if some one is in the room, but I'm afraid that they fail quickly in foggy/wet situations.
The humidity sensor is something which hadn't crossed my mind yet. That sounds like a very good idea.
The oregon sensors seem to be in a 'big' box. Preferably it would not be visible at all, so putting a sensor in the exhaust pipe would be better. I think the Oregon units are not really suited for that but I'll see what I can find from other brands. I haven't really thought about having sensors in the house, but perhaps it's time to do so.
The mirror should be turned off when the lights go off, that's true (it makes no sense shaving in the dark). I've also thought about putting in a motion detector, to "see" if some one is in the room, but I'm afraid that they fail quickly in foggy/wet situations.
The humidity sensor is something which hadn't crossed my mind yet. That sounds like a very good idea.
The oregon sensors seem to be in a 'big' box. Preferably it would not be visible at all, so putting a sensor in the exhaust pipe would be better. I think the Oregon units are not really suited for that but I'll see what I can find from other brands. I haven't really thought about having sensors in the house, but perhaps it's time to do so.
Watermeter / flowmeter
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I'll provide info about where and for how long hot water was used later.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Nitpicking: you've put a comma too much in your URL.
Thanks so far! I know there is not much data yet, but it seems like it's taking quite a while to cool down.
Thanks so far! I know there is not much data yet, but it seems like it's taking quite a while to cool down.
Watermeter / flowmeter
Ventilator on when the light goes on is not such a good idea, a lot of times you go in the bathroom and not using hot water ore take a shit at all
Also lot's of time a more vent noise. I can operate my ventilator manual and based on what ever sensor I have there (motion, dark light, temp, humidity)
Advantage of the small Oregon sensor that you can also visually see the temperature and humidity on the small LCD screen. It's also possible to place a 1-Wire or RFXcom Humidity/Temp sensor, but keep in mind to place wahtever sensor as high as possible, steam goes first to the ceiling.
Also lot's of time a more vent noise. I can operate my ventilator manual and based on what ever sensor I have there (motion, dark light, temp, humidity)
Advantage of the small Oregon sensor that you can also visually see the temperature and humidity on the small LCD screen. It's also possible to place a 1-Wire or RFXcom Humidity/Temp sensor, but keep in mind to place wahtever sensor as high as possible, steam goes first to the ceiling.
Watermeter / flowmeter
I haven't found a way yet to detect if someone is doing a number 2 or number 1. Perhaps after the fact if the toilet is flushed, but I'd prefer if the vents would go on sooner.
But in the new bathroom there won't be a toilet anymore. We are going to put the toilet in a wall closet. It sounds small, but is actually the same size as the toilet downstairs, although many people we need to show the measurements to convince them.
I don't mind if the vent are on a bit if someone only did a number 1 so the vents switching for the lights in the toilets would be OK.
As the vents are always on a low setting and never totally off a humidity sensor in the exhaust pipe for the bathroom would pick up the steam, I guess.
But in the new bathroom there won't be a toilet anymore. We are going to put the toilet in a wall closet. It sounds small, but is actually the same size as the toilet downstairs, although many people we need to show the measurements to convince them.
I don't mind if the vent are on a bit if someone only did a number 1 so the vents switching for the lights in the toilets would be OK.
As the vents are always on a low setting and never totally off a humidity sensor in the exhaust pipe for the bathroom would pick up the steam, I guess.
Watermeter / flowmeter
A temperature drop of 10 degrees takes about 10-15 minutes after you've stopped using hot water.
I think it's possible to do something with that, maybe in combination with other inputs.
Jeroen, i have an xls for you if you want it.
I think it's possible to do something with that, maybe in combination with other inputs.
Jeroen, i have an xls for you if you want it.
Watermeter / flowmeter
I don't need your data, I believe you right away
As I was afraid it does take a bit of time for the water pipe to cool down so I'm probably not going to do this. Many thanks for testing this! At least I know have some idea what to expect.
As I was afraid it does take a bit of time for the water pipe to cool down so I'm probably not going to do this. Many thanks for testing this! At least I know have some idea what to expect.
Watermeter / flowmeter
You're welcome Actually, i removed some wiring for sensors and other stuff from the central heating some time ago when it was broken (again), just to avoid lengthy discussions with the maintenance man saying that *i* was causing the problems with all my wires and devices. So in fact this was a good reason/trigger to reinstall some of the things
Actually, i removed some wiring for sensors and other stuff from the central heating some time ago when it was broken (again), just to avoid lengthy discussions with the maintenance man saying that *i* was causing the problems with all my wires and devices. So in fact this was a good reason/trigger to reinstall some of the things